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Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 14:31:16 -0500
Reply-To: DCHAS-L Discussion List <DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU>
Sender: DCHAS-L Discussion List <DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU>
From: Rita Kay Calhoun <r.calhoun**At_Symbol_Here**MOREHEADSTATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: GLOVES IN STUDENT LABS
In-Reply-To: <2317fc9b1003081224r7711847bgc8523165fffa5e08**At_Symbol_Here**mail.gmail.com>
What an interesting convergence of events! But, this helps point out what
I've been trying to say. Not all labs are the same. In my introductory ch
emistry lab there is no bottle of Chloroform, labeled or unlabeled. The la
bs are prepped and deprepped each week. The only constants are Water - tap
and deioinzed, and soap. When we do an experiment where the student dete
rmine the volume of a drop of water, that's all that is there. When we det
ermine the density of a saline solution, we bring in saline solution. That
's it. The benchtops have been cleaned at the end of the previous week.
No dermal hazard in the room!
And to add a comment in reply to another post:
Monona, your comment about "flying glass and chemicals" really illustrates
the crux of the issue. You realize that "glass" is not in and of itself a
hazard, but that "flying glass" is. At the same time, you use "chemical" a
s synonymous with hazardous. This is incorrect. Not even all chemicals us
ed in lab are hazardous. The physical universe is made of matter and energ
y (let's ignore dark matter and dark energy). ALL matter is chemical. We
try to teach our students to be precise in their language.
Remember, every Thing that is good for us, that we treasure is a bunch of c
hemicals.
Kay Calhoun
-----Original Message-----
From: DCHAS-L Discussion List [mailto:DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**list.uvm.edu] On Behalf Of An
drew Gross
Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 3:25 PM
To: DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU
Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] GLOVES IN STUDENT LABS
This is a real thing that happened to me LAST WEEK. Before you read
on and think I'm totally bashing the water theory...I think the THINK
philosophy proposed is excellent...but enforce your authority of my
lab...my rules.
I was analyzing things in a photospec. I had some glycerine on my
fingers and went to rinse it off so i didnt contaminate the curvettes.
I grabbed a squirt bottle and said to myself...that don't feel like
water...then I went for the first thing sturdy to hold myself up on as
I started to pass out. Turns out the label on the chloroform squirt
bottle wore off and and someone removed it from the fume hood making
it appear like DI water. THAT IS THE HAZARD BEHIND ONE DROP OF
WATER!!!! Accidents happen and incorrect lableing is one of them. I
should have been wearing gloves but I said...what is the hazard. I am
an experienced chemist, I can make my own calls on safety in those
regards...and even I made the wrong call. Students should be taught
what I disregarded, once they have their own lab they can disregard
safety on their own discression and experience.
By the way, since this discussion has started I have been wearing FULL
PPE so as not be be a hippacrit...even when pouring water.
On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 1:20 PM, Rita Kay Calhoun
wrote:
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Would one of you please exp
lain to me the dermal hazard
> associated with determining the volume of a drop of water?=A0 Or perhaps
the
> density of a saline solution?=A0 As I said in my original response there
is
> guidance given to the students in their risk assessment.=A0 And if their
> assessment is inadequate, there is "You will wear gloves, period".=A0 Whe
n
> students understand, they are much more likely to comply.=A0 When they se
e the
> rules as simply something People-in-Authority impose because they're in
> authority and want control, the students try to get away with not
> complying.=A0 I do teach your children safety.=A0 I also try to teach the
m to
> think.=A0 The most important safety rule you can learn is to think.
> Everything else flows from that.
>
>
>
> Kay Calhoun
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: DCHAS-L Discussion List [mailto:DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**list.uvm.edu] On Behalf Of
> Moorefield, Mubetcel
> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 7:44 AM
>
> To: DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU
> Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] GLOVES IN STUDENT LABS
>
>
>
> I am surprised to see there is even a discussion of whether to ask the
> students to wear gloves or not.=A0 That is probably why even the chemists
who
> graduate with PhD in chemistry have hard time following=A0those simple
> safety=A0rules when they get a job in the industry.
>
>
>
> As teaching profession, I would expect you to teach my child how to be sa
fe
> in a lab as well as how to set up a reaction.=A0 It should be part of the
> teaching curriculum.=A0 I am pretty sure you are teaching them not to pou
r
> hazardous chemicals down the drain so the environment doesn't get hurt.
=A0 Why
> would you question if it=A0 is necessary to teach them not to hurt
> themselves?=A0 Discussion of recovering the cost should be a separate iss
ue.
>
>
>
> Mubetcel
>
>
>
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> ________________________________
>
> From: DCHAS-L Discussion List [mailto:DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**list.uvm.edu] On Behalf Of
> Kennedy, Sheila
> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 6:32 PM
> To: DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**LIST.UVM.EDU
> Subject: [DCHAS-L] GLOVES IN STUDENT LABS
>
> As the staff of the Chemistry & Biochemistry Teaching Labs, we have been
> asked to propose ideas for saving money, as budgets are only getting tigh
ter
> over the next few years. One idea proposed is that we stop providing glov
es
> ad lib. to students, but have them buy & bring their own. We currently
> supply either nitrile or PVC examination (thin, single-use) gloves in our
> labs.
>
> Do you provide/require gloves for student labs?
>
>
>
> Sheila
>
> --
> Sheila M. Kennedy, CHO
> Safety Coordinator
> Chemistry & Biochemistry Teaching Laboratories
> University of California, San Diego
> (858) 534-0221
>
>
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